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Is there consensus on 50's P90's?

thin sissy

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Hi all!

I was reading the following article:

https://guitar.com/guides/essential...skh6M2-qJlHMH6QYZ5G7UeA7qnbg-RJiSZ4TO5Iwmssz4

It made me wonder, is it considered "fact" that P90's had A3 magnets until about 1957, and then got A5's? Or is that simplifying it?

I sometimes wonder what the differences are between my 57 Jr and my 55 Goldtop's P90's, they sure have different voices. But maybe that's just down to how each pickup is different? :hmm
 

Highway Star

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I don't know anything about the magnets but a Jr. and a Goldtop are two pretty different guitars. They would sound different even if you used the same pair of pickups. Taken it even further, two goldtops would sound different with the same pair of pickups :biggrin:
 

thin sissy

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Yeah man, I agree :peace2 I was thinking, with all the knowledge of the evolution of PAF's out there, maybe a similar timeline of P-90's could be created?

It's not super important I guess, but interesting nonwtheless :) .

I've read on this forum that 52/53 P90's are different from later ones, and also that around 57 they became more powerful. Does that mean there were three "styles" of P90's in the 50's? I somehow doubt the answer is that simple though :hmm
 

goldtop0

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Contact Eric Ernest at Abalone Vintage, he's right up with all P90 info.
Got a pair of '52s from him earlier in the year.
 

jwalker

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A3 in P90's is easy to spot. The magnets are visibly thicker and will not fit in a PAF. All of the A3 P90's I have seen have been '52 and '53 era pickups.
 

MapleFlame

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Variations in every year, but extensive play with P90's early ones had more clarity and articulation, mid 50's slightly higher output and great bite when driven especially the Juniors. Yes as the 50's went on they got stronger with the 59's seeming like they provided more output. We had a discussion about this many years ago and the above seemed to be the consensus. I'm sure you can find the Thread in the search tab. You will not find a better collection of members who have had an extensive experience with so many guitars over the years. I have 52,54, 56, and 57 Gold tops, also have juniors, specials and 225's. I put 50's P90's in replicas too. Have a couple 69 Gold tops as well.
 

Hamerfan

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Yep, the 52/53 magnets are different in size and make to the later humbucker style magnets. Very porous structure and 3/16 thick.

image.jpg
 

thin sissy

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Thank you everybody for your replies! :)

This is an interesting topic, even though I love all my P-90's regardless of their specs. The 52/53 version seems cool by the descriptions I've seen, hope to play those one day.

So, is this timeline for LP's and P-90's somewhat correct to you guys? (again, allowing for inconsistencies that often come with Gibson)

52->53: A3 version
53->57: A5 version
57->59: A5 version, generally hotter
59->?: A5 version, even hotter

I guess this makes my 57 Jr a bit hard to categorize, no big worry though :hee
 

duaneflowers

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Another interesting thing to note is that during the 50s the wire got progressively thinner... maybe it coz the mags were getting thinner too :hee
 

thin sissy

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Aha, I didn't know that! Do you know if the wire itself got thinner, or the insulation alone, or both?
 

tooold

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The absent-but-missed j45 always maintained that early '50's P90's were special. Many years ago, I followed his advice and bought a few; two are in a couple of SG Juniors ('62 and '65) and they live up to their billing - they're clear and articulate, which actually helps with a tweed at 10. The P90's on my '50 ES-300N (some of you saw it at Richard's at the LPFUK get-together several years ago) sound just beautiful. And, true to form, the P90 in my '60 TV is super strong - it seems to hit you in the face.

It would be fascinating to really nail this stuff down, but even without the history, long live P90's! I don't even own any humbucker guitars any more. :dude:
 

thin sissy

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The absent-but-missed j45 always maintained that early '50's P90's were special. Many years ago, I followed his advice and bought a few; two are in a couple of SG Juniors ('62 and '65) and they live up to their billing - they're clear and articulate, which actually helps with a tweed at 10. The P90's on my '50 ES-300N (some of you saw it at Richard's at the LPFUK get-together several years ago) sound just beautiful. And, true to form, the P90 in my '60 TV is super strong - it seems to hit you in the face.

It would be fascinating to really nail this stuff down, but even without the history, long live P90's! I don't even own any humbucker guitars any more. :dude:
I really hope to try the early P-90's someday, they are very interesting! Also, too bad j45 doesn't seem to post anymore.

I couldn't agree more on P-90's, they really are the perfect blend of single coil clarity and fatness :dude:
 

goldtop0

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My '52s read 8.05 neck and 9.63 bridge, they put out more volume, are more articulate and clearer airy than any PAF, T-Top or other stock Gibson humbucker that I've played over the decades.
 

Hamerfan

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Thank you everybody for your replies! :)

This is an interesting topic, even though I love all my P-90's regardless of their specs. The 52/53 version seems cool by the descriptions I've seen, hope to play those one day.

So, is this timeline for LP's and P-90's somewhat correct to you guys? (again, allowing for inconsistencies that often come with Gibson)

52->53: A3 version
53->57: A5 version
57->59: A5 version, generally hotter
59->?: A5 version, even hotter

I guess this makes my 57 Jr a bit hard to categorize, no big worry though :hee

p90 mags

magnets: rough and thicker (3/16 inch) A3 up to 53, then PAF-like (2/16 thick) A4 but with a different formulation than today, then in mid 1961 short A4 or A5 / A2 or whatever they could get.

magnet size: 2.5” up to mid 1961, than 2.25"
 

thin sissy

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p90 mags

magnets: rough and thicker (3/16 inch) A3 up to 53, then PAF-like (2/16 thick) A4 but with a different formulation than today, then in mid 1961 short A4 or A5 / A2 or whatever they could get.

magnet size: 2.5” up to mid 1961, than 2.25"
Oh wow, so A4 was a part of it as well? Does that mean both my 55 and 57 might have A4's, even though they sound so different? :rofl

It's a good thing they all seem to have a great sound, no matter the specs (IMHO). I don't own, but played, a 62 SG Jr (Les Paul Jr I guess?), it had another feel, great though. Maybe a bit treblier than my LP's?
 

Hamerfan

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Oh wow, so A4 was a part of it as well? Does that mean both my 55 and 57 might have A4's, even though they sound so different? :rofl

It's a good thing they all seem to have a great sound, no matter the specs (IMHO). I don't own, but played, a 62 SG Jr (Les Paul Jr I guess?), it had another feel, great though. Maybe a bit treblier than my LP's?

https://www.amberpickups.com/NEWS/INFO/Mythos-AlNiCo/

They tested mags from 1956 to 1960 from humbuckers and P90. They found all where similar to nowadays A4, but different from A5, A2 and A3.
 
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