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lets talk about back colors .......

tripletime

Les Paul Froum Member
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Jan 4, 2018
Messages
189
so I spent some time looking at a book called "the les paul legacy" by Lawrence

this got me thinking about all the different historic back colors I have seen thru the years vs the photos in the book.

I have only one historic which is a 57 goldtop

my historic has a back color which matches the photos in the book.

lets refer to this color as "red chocolate "

but I have also seen this same guitar with an amber color ranging from lighter to darker - lets call this "honey amber"

I don't see this honey amber anywhere in the book - why are some gold tops honey amber ?

look at this photo of Freddie King - his goldtop is red chocolate

s-l1000.jpg



looking at the BOTB book

all the burst ( save a few special exceptions ) are all a red chocolate which is just like the goldtop but the combo tilts more to the red

if we move on to the early SG model - they too were this red chocolate

whats my point ? - it seem like the only correct color for a goldtop or burst historic ( minus dark back) is a chocolaty raspberry mix


anyone agree ?

original.jpg
 
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Tom Wittrock

Les Paul Forum Co-Owner
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Aug 2, 2001
Messages
42,567
looking at the BOTB book

all the burst ( save a few special exceptions ) are all a red chocolate which is just like the goldtop but the combo tilts more to the red

if we move on to the early SG model - they too were this red chocolate

whats my point ? - it seem like the only correct color for a goldtop or burst historic ( minus dark back) is a chocolaty raspberry mix


anyone agree ?

original.jpg

Not in the slightest. :ganz

And, why did you choose a Burst from BOTB that is refinished? :wah
 

tripletime

Les Paul Froum Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Messages
189
that photo was just a random image I got off the internet

perhaps you can give me a few serial numbers from the BOTB that are amber - I don't see any

or perhaps a few nice "light amber backed" guitars that you had or still own - would love to see a photo - if you could be so kind
 

Tom Wittrock

Les Paul Forum Co-Owner
Joined
Aug 2, 2001
Messages
42,567
that photo was just a random image I got off the internet

perhaps you can give me a few serial numbers from the BOTB that are amber - I don't see any

or perhaps a few nice "light amber backed" guitars that you had or still own - would love to see a photo - if you could be so kind

All the Bursts I ever had [over 60] had cherry red backs, with most having various amounts of fade.
Same with all I can remember seeing in person [another 100? ... I never kept count].

Red chocolate and amber are not colors I associate with real Bursts. :)
 

tripletime

Les Paul Froum Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Messages
189
All the Bursts I ever had [over 60] had cherry red backs, with most having various amounts of fade.
Same with all I can remember seeing in person [another 100? ... I never kept count].

Red chocolate and amber are not colors I associate with real Bursts. :)

that's exactly my point !

then why is Gibson making historics that are not cherry red ?

(as I just showed in the example above )



if we look at Gibsons own web page - how does this color relate to cherry red ?

http://www.gibson.com/products/elec.../standard-historic-1957-les-paul-goldtop.aspx

would it be a huge stretch for me to call the color I am seeing amber ???????





 
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sws1

Well-known member
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Dec 4, 2001
Messages
2,846
if we look at Gibsons own web page - how does this color relate to cherry red ?

It doesn't. Goldtops had a different color back than bursts. Goldtops were brown (if they weren't dark back) and bursts were red stained, which then had the tendency to fade from hardly anything to alot...in some cases, almost approaching the brown (not the same, but in the neighborhood) you see on a GT.
 

clearmudd

Active member
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May 26, 2016
Messages
499
that's exactly my point !

then why is Gibson making historics that are not cherry red ?

(as I just showed in the example above )



if we look at Gibsons own web page - how does this color relate to cherry red ?

http://www.gibson.com/products/elec.../standard-historic-1957-les-paul-goldtop.aspx

would it be a huge stretch for me to call the color I am seeing amber ???????










Gold tops did not not have Cherry backs.............they were mostly natural and the nitro clear coat yellowed over time.......1950s Honduras mahogany can be reddish in color.....the exceptions to Gold Top back colors was the "dark back" and the all gold painted Les Paul............the "dark back" was a walnut color and the guitar was often fitted with black plastics.......Cherry red backs was exclusive to "Sunburst" models '58 - '60......
 

Tom Wittrock

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Messages
42,567
that's exactly my point !

then why is Gibson making historics that are not cherry red ?

(as I just showed in the example above )

The examples above are an early 50s Goldtop [with Freddie King] and my old Robert Johnson Burst that was refinished.
There is no example of a Historic above. :bigal
 

tripletime

Les Paul Froum Member
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Jan 4, 2018
Messages
189
The examples above are an early 50s Goldtop [with Freddie King] and my old Robert Johnson Burst that was refinished.
There is no example of a Historic above. :bigal


yes there is :

http://www.peachguitars.com/guitars...stom-true-historic-1957-les-paul-goldtop-.htm

heck take a look at Garys Classic Guitars who is a forum dealer - his link is part of the forum banner

look at the vintage goldtops he has for sale or has sold

what color are the backs ?


they look red to me - I don't see them being any kind of yellowish amber like the official Gibson page shows


here is a link to a fine Goldtop - would it be wrong to say that THIS color back - which mine is close to would be the correct color ?

https://www.garysguitars.com/catalog/1968-gibson-les-paul-standard-gold-top
 

tripletime

Les Paul Froum Member
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Jan 4, 2018
Messages
189
Gold tops did not not have Cherry backs.............they were mostly natural and the nitro clear coat yellowed over time.......1950s Honduras mahogany can be reddish in color.....the exceptions to Gold Top back colors was the "dark back" and the all gold painted Les Paul............the "dark back" was a walnut color and the guitar was often fitted with black plastics.......Cherry red backs was exclusive to "Sunburst" models '58 - '60......

what are you basing that on ?

I do NOT believe you are correct about them being natural - I believe they were RED


what say yea Mr W ?

hl00330972.jpg
 
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clearmudd

Active member
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Messages
499
what are you basing that on ?

I do NOT believe you are correct about them being natural - I believe they were RED


what say yea Mr W ?

hl00330972.jpg
Go to burstserial.com.....click on 1957......then click any serial number and can see photos of any 1957 serial posted on that sight....judge for yourself...

take in mind some of these have been refinished but good originals are serial numbers 7 3957.......7 3746....7 3941....7 5714....7 6631.....7 7667....7 7677......7 8804....... some are "DARK BACKS" with white serials and black plastics,.... though some do sport cream.

Don't forget the 1958s.........all the way up to 8 3087 were GOLD TOPS....check those out too.... burstserial.com do yourself a favor.
 
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Tom Wittrock

Les Paul Forum Co-Owner
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what are you basing that on ?

I do NOT believe you are correct about them being natural - I believe they were RED


what say yea Mr W ?

I've never seen an original 50s Goldtop with a red back. I've only seen a few hundred, but none of those had a red back.
And, I've never even seen a photo of one.


And while we're at it, there are no Historics/reissues shown in your first post, even though you claim there are.
But, there are only two guitars in that post, neither of which are Historics/reissues. :wah
 

madformac

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Feb 24, 2013
Messages
719
what are you basing that on ?

I do NOT believe you are correct about them being natural - I believe they were RED


Never seen an original 50's Goldtop with a factory red back. Just natural/light brown or darkbacks.


Beliefs and facts are often two different things. :hmm
 

tripletime

Les Paul Froum Member
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Jan 4, 2018
Messages
189
what color would you call this ?????????

I might be color blind and not know it

this looks more dark red brown to me then the amber yellow color Gibson used many years and is is shown for all to see in the Gibson web page I provided


here is the color every goldtop in the book has:

https://www.garysguitars.com/catalog/1952-gibson-les-paul-gold-top-gie0435



here is the link again - you were correct it was not in my first post - but in a later one


http://www.gibson.com/products/elec.../standard-historic-1957-les-paul-goldtop.aspx

I cant find one photo of a vintage goldtop that is that color
 

clearmudd

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May 26, 2016
Messages
499

Sct13

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Messages
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Just the Cherry please, I did like how my 03' faded with time....
 
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