Neck profiles during the 50's (V necks?)

[thin sissy]

I had a conversation a while ago with someone who knows a lot about old guitars, and when I said that I love my 1957 Jr neck, the slight "V" shape, he said that he never saw a 50's Les Paul with V necks. And to be honest, I don't know what the profile on my guitar looks like, I only know what I feel. I also have a 1955 Goldtop that has a different feel, I would call it more round, and maybe slightly thinner.

The common thing about both these guitars is how well they are rounded off on the "shoulders", they feel thinner than they are. It feels like the people who shaped them really tried to make them comfortable.

So my question is, do you guys have experience with 50's Les Pauls that have V shaped necks? Are there trends to different years, or is it totally random? Is it possible my 57 even has a v shaped neck, or is it a trick of the mind?

For reference: my 2007 R8, and many other CS Les Pauls, have felt thicker than either of my vintage LPs. Probably due to the shoulders.

 

[JASIII]

I think the term "V" neck is most commonly associated with 50's Fenders, particularly Strats. It's a pretty distinct feel. For reference I have a replica late 50's LP Jr. that I put together that has the typical "Baseball Bat" neck profile associated with those guitars. It's one of my favorite necks. I wouldn't call it a "V" though. It's big and beefy. Perhaps your neck just has more rounded off shoulders, as you suggested. Feel can be subjective to a degree. It might have a feel that makes you think "V", but it could be worlds apart from a Fender "V" of the same era, as it should be. Vintage guitars were made by hand so variations are to be expected.

 

[brandtkronholm]

Of course there are 50s Les Pauls and other Gibsons with “V” necks.

I had a red 1959 Jr. for a very short time in the early ‘90s that had the BIGGEST “V” neck ever. Due to my inferior musicianship I couldn’t make it sound good so off it went. The headstock was cracked but stable. I didn’t own it long enough to have it properly fixed.

Around the same time I had a ‘50s tune-o-matic gold top that had an enormous “V” neck. It was slightly smaller than the Jr. I mentioned above. It was refinished (painted over?) all black and looked awesome, but again, I couldn’t get a good sound out of it. I sold it for maybe $1500 in the early ‘90s.

That being said, it has been my experience that the big/round shoulder “D” shape is a little more common.

Your mileage may vary.

 

[Xpensive Wino]

Neck profiles varied.

 

[jb_abides]

I understood that many 57 gold tops, and accordingly R7s, have 'Soft-V' profiles. I know mine do.

Was this incorrect? [And, did they change this on R7s?]

 

[thin sissy]

I think the term "V" neck is most commonly associated with 50's Fenders, particularly Strats. It's a pretty distinct feel. For reference I have a replica late 50's LP Jr. that I put together that has the typical "Baseball Bat" neck profile associated with those guitars. It's one of my favorite necks. I wouldn't call it a "V" though. It's big and beefy. Perhaps your neck just has more rounded off shoulders, as you suggested. Feel can be subjective to a degree. It might have a feel that makes you think "V", but it could be worlds apart from a Fender "V" of the same era, as it should be. Vintage guitars were made by hand so variations are to be expected.

Thanks for your reply! I must confess that the only experience I have with vintage Fenders is a 56 Tele, which had a pretty thin and round neck, so I don't know what qualifies as a fender V neck. What you are saying sounds reasonable though.

I am def open to the idea that my Jr isn't exactly V, just rounded off a lot. I wish I could see it in profile.

 

[thin sissy]

Of course there are 50s Les Pauls and other Gibsons with “V” necks.

I had a red 1959 Jr. for a very short time in the early ‘90s that had the BIGGEST “V” neck ever. Due to my inferior musicianship I couldn’t make it sound good so off it went. The headstock was cracked but stable. I didn’t own it long enough to have it properly fixed.

Around the same time I had a ‘50s tune-o-matic gold top that had an enormous “V” neck. It was slightly smaller than the Jr. I mentioned above. It was refinished (painted over?) all black and looked awesome, but again, I couldn’t get a good sound out of it. I sold it for maybe $1500 in the early ‘90s.

That being said, it has been my experience that the big/round shoulder “D” shape is a little more common.

Your mileage may vary.

This is also very interesting! I wonder if the fact that I don't have big "D" necks is just chance? I have to admit that my hands and feel might be a bit off, I played a techs 61 Jr once, and he said "the neck on this thing is terrible, it is so thick", and I thought it was nice and alright. I wonder if my references are off.

I've tried a few 30's acoustics which had VERY thick V necks (as I would describe them), and I think that was a wonderful profile, one that is never seen in modern guitars. Maybe because I have long and thin fingers?

 

[thin sissy]

I understood that many 57 gold tops, and accordingly R7s, have 'Soft-V' profiles. I know mine do.

Was this incorrect? [And, did they change this on R7s?]

I would be interested in this! How many different people shaped the necks in 1957? Was there a guy who made them V shaped, but not in 1955? Or was it based on the model? Or was it completely random?

 

[renderit]

My 55 M2M has a V.

They said it was vintage accurate.

It is a very "soft" large rounded V but definitely a V.

Most peeps who didn't know what a V is would not call it that when played, but I have not found anybody who plays it that does not like it.

My 57 Gold Top Historics are all rounded not V'd but I supposed all the reissues could be wrong.

The actual real 57's I have touched I don't recall having V's and I only remember playing 2 actual 55's and recall the necks differed greatly from the 54's, but I was young then and not so much anymore...

 

[jb_abides]

It is a very "soft" large rounded V but definitely a V.

Same.

 

[DutchRay]

My '55 Goldtop certainly has a slight V shape. My '57 ES-225T and ES-225TD also have a hint of a V but less pronounced than the '55.

 

[chuck dale]

Not a 50's guitar but my Greg Martin CC #15 patterned after his 58 "Hank " has a slight V-

 

[latestarter]

The '54 Goldtop I couldn't land had a nice soft V...noticeably V.

I had a '64 SG Jr with a soft V also.

I've not experienced an R7 with a V neck, but my '99 R9 has a very soft V...or maybe simply less pronounced shoulders.

 

[brandtkronholm]

This is also very interesting! I wonder if the fact that I don't have big "D" necks is just chance? I have to admit that my hands and feel might be a bit off, I played a techs 61 Jr once, and he said "the neck on this thing is terrible, it is so thick", and I thought it was nice and alright. I wonder if my references are off.

I've tried a few 30's acoustics which had VERY thick V necks (as I would describe them), and I think that was a wonderful profile, one that is never seen in modern guitars. Maybe because I have long and thin fingers?

I'm pretty confident that you don't have D necks is both chance and the simple possibility that D necks just don't speak to you as loudly as a V.
References aren't critical at all as you determine what guitar appeals to you. Historical accuracy is a minor consideration from a player's perspective. Historical accuracy may give rise to some very comfy and classic neck shapes. I love a fat '59 but that skinny '61 is so nice and fast!

Moreover, during past few decades, as Gibson continues on perfecting recreations of the classic instruments from the '50s and '60s, the forensic information gathered may have directed them to sometimes build V necks and at other times build D neck - often within the same year or two and even on the same reissue model.

I wonder what the guiding force was behind the enormous round necks on the R7s, R8s, and R9s from the very late 1990s into the early 2000s. They weren't historically accurate, but maybe they appealed to some players.

But like Xpensive Wino said: "Neck profiles varied." Gibson electrics from the '50s and early '60s had all sorts of neck shapes. Your references are fine, no matter how many vintage guitars you've encountered.

I imagine the thick V necks you encountered on some '30s Gibsons were simply an artifact of Gibson transitioning into the adjustable truss rod which was patented and first used by Gibson in the '20s. Big necks without a truss rod might be more stable than a smaller neck with a truss rod. It just took Gibson a while to realize this. This being said, some of the necks on the late '30s Super 400s and L5s can be nice, round, fast, and very modern.

Boy I'd like a prewar L5 or Super 400 ... late '30s or early '40s...I digress...

 

[thin sissy]

I'm pretty confident that you don't have D necks is both chance and the simple possibility that D necks just don't speak to you as loudly as a V.
References aren't critical at all as you determine what guitar appeals to you. Historical accuracy is a minor consideration from a player's perspective. Historical accuracy may give rise to some very comfy and classic neck shapes. I love a fat '59 but that skinny '61 is so nice and fast!

Moreover, during past few decades, as Gibson continues on perfecting recreations of the classic instruments from the '50s and '60s, the forensic information gathered may have directed them to sometimes build V necks and at other times build D neck - often within the same year or two and even on the same reissue model.

I wonder what the guiding force was behind the enormous round necks on the R7s, R8s, and R9s from the very late 1990s into the early 2000s. They weren't historically accurate, but maybe they appealed to some players.

But like Xpensive Wino said: "Neck profiles varied." Gibson electrics from the '50s and early '60s had all sorts of neck shapes. Your references are fine, no matter how many vintage guitars you've encountered.

I imagine the thick V necks you encountered on some '30s Gibsons were simply an artifact of Gibson transitioning into the adjustable truss rod which was patented and first used by Gibson in the '20s. Big necks without a truss rod might be more stable than a smaller neck with a truss rod. It just took Gibson a while to realize this. This being said, some of the necks on the late '30s Super 400s and L5s can be nice, round, fast, and very modern.

Boy I'd like a prewar L5 or Super 400 ... late '30s or early '40s...I digress...

You make a lot of sense. I will probably try a profile gauge on my guitars some day to "see" what I'm feeling.

None of this is important of course, but I think it's interesting

 

[jimmi]

Most of the 50s arch top LPs (ie Stds/Customs) that I have played have neck profiles that fall somewhere between the current (ie less shouldered) R9 and V2 R0 reissue necks. I have played a couple that are a little junkier and a couple of 60s that had the really thin necks but most, even the ‘57-‘58s fall between those. The student level guitars (Jrs, Specials and melody makers) tend to have thicker necks…maybe because they were cheaper and less time spent on them or maybe because Gibson thought they would be handled buy players more likely to drop them.

 

[Wilko]

I've had two '30s Gibson archtops with a definite V shape. More common on Martins, even my '77 D-28 has more V than a lot of them. My '57 D-18 was a serious V.

 

[Xpensive Wino]

I've had two '30s Gibson archtops with a definite V shape. More common on Martins, even my '77 D-28 has more V than a lot of them. My '57 D-18 was a serious V.

I love me a V neck - on a Strat, that is.

 

[brandtkronholm]

I've had two '30s Gibson archtops with a definite V shape. More common on Martins, even my '77 D-28 has more V than a lot of them. My '57 D-18 was a serious V.

Oh man, you’re right about those Martins! I had a 1976 D28 that had a massive sharp V neck!

I now have a D42 with a medium/thin C neck that plays like butter and sounds beautiful.

 

[guitplayer]

True V is on fenders and Martins . Slight V is not