Really bad tuning problem

[D'Mule]

If the OP is really tuning up to pitch, I don't see how his pitch can go flat due to a tight nut. Only get sharper.

Not sure why a problem with re-stringing would be limited to the G string?

I've never personally had a tuner fail, but this seems suspicious...

I'm admittedly a freak, but I would swap a tuner from a different guitar to see if that corrects the problem.

 

[Hiwatt]

+1... so true.

Hiwatt:

What brand strings?
Confirm that you always tune "up" to the note from at least a whole step below?
How much string stretching after you've restrung?
Did the guitar always have this problem?
Is it seasonal? Don't laugh, change of seasons freaks some guitars out.

And in the end...

Take your guitar to good luthier/repairman and he'll get it sorted out.

Hi I use either Ernie Ball or D'addario it isn't a string problem.I stretch and stretch and stretch again so my strings are always properly stretched in!It has always had tunning issues yeah but it does seem to be a bit worse than it used to be.Looking at the nut slot for the G string there doesn't seem to be a proper slot as such.The string just sort of sits on it but I've heard this can be better than a "deeper" nut slot?My SG has a deeper slot that the string will sit in.I do think personally that this is an issue with the nut and will have to have a proper tech have a look at it.I'm unable to gig with it as it's just too unstable.It doesn't always happen it seems to be an intermittent thing but will always happen playing live.Typical.
Thanks for your replies/advice folks.

 

[CHarg]

Maybe the ball end is binding somehow and not fully seated in the tailpiece?
When you restring, does the ball end come out of the tailpiece easily, or do you have to use something to push it out?
(and thanks for the welcome, garywright)

 

[guitplayer]

.I'm unable to gig with it as it's just too unstable.It doesn't always happen it seems to be an intermittent thing but will always happen playing live.Typical.
Thanks for your replies/advice folks.

Thats a bad time.
Got to be nut "G" slot or if its going out of tune sitting there . After proper wind, stretch etc...I`d consider replacing that "G" tuner and see.:hank

 

[Leebak]

i think maybe it can be the tuner, but in my poor experience, most tunning issues are solved by puting some graphite on the nut.

 

[Boogie Bill]

I'm not buying that it is a nut issue...the problems the OP describes does not fit my experience.

I do use and recommend the Big Bend's Nut Sauce. This will solve 99% of the problems with strings binding in the nut. I also use it in the saddle grooves.

One thing to check though, is making sure the nut is glued in properly. This would be pretty obvious on a Gibson. But a friend of mine had the nut on his Strat come unglued and was having all kinds of problems with tuning...he never really noticed the loose nut, as he changed his strings on at a time. When the luthier took of the strings, the nut fell off. Couple drops of white glue--problem solved.


================

Make sure that the truss rod nut has positive tension on it, and is not spinning freely. Even if you don't need a lot of pressure on the rod, the nut needs to be snugged up. This caused a tuning issue for me with one of my older Gibsons. Easy fix.


================

I have had problems with the ball-end twist slipping. This was with some high-E strings from D'Addario. They acknowledged that was a factory issue. They comped me some new strings and apparently fixed the problem--no trouble since.

Now, you can check for this. Next time you do a string change, compare the twist end of your old string to your new string. Take a measurement of the new string from the ball end to the final twist and write it down for future reference. If you notice a difference at that next string change, that would indicate a string issue.

Be sure the ball end is correctly seated in the stop tail.

I have also had an issue with a rough spot in the stop tail that was actually cutting the string. A quick touch with a Dremel tool fixed that; luckily it was plainly visible. If you think this could be a contributing cause, try putting the string through a small diameter piece of shrink tubing where it goes through the stop tail. A lot of Strat guys do this with their Synchronized Tremolo bridges.


================

I would very carefully inspect the tuners. Take your string winder and with the strings off, wind it until the post makes a complete revolution. Do it forward and backwards. It there is any play or roughness, your should be able to feel it. Most companies make very good tuners, but occasionally they do go bad.

If your guitar has Grover, Schaller or Sperzel tuners, make sure that the bushing nut is tight, BUT DO NOT OVER-TIGHTEN.

With Klusons, you may need to lube the tuner. I've done a couple with Big Bends. I just read something about the factory injecting warm Vaseline petroleum jelly into the tuner as the post is rotated. Whatever you use, use it sparingly, and wipe off the excess.

Check that the tuner is seated correctly, and the screws are holding it tight.


================

With regards to stringing the tuning machines: I wrap the strings around the post, using the loop-over to lock the string on the post. Check out the Martin website; their Care And Feeding guide has a string changing pictorial, and this is the technique I use. Two to four neat winds are all you need, though I usually wind the plain string a little more than I do the wound strings. You can have too many winds on the post. And always wind the string DOWN the post so that the string crosses the nut from close to the faceplate of the headstock. The post should not be so fully wound that the string touches the faceplate. Neatness counts, absolutely no overlaps. Ever.

When I restring, I do some light stretching, and then I try to let the guitar sit untouched for 24 hours. Then retune. This seems to add to tuning stability, and also seems to increase string life. And yes, always tune UP to pitch.


================

I'm sure you're using a top-quality string. But you might try the new D'Addario NYXLs, as they are supposed to have better tuning stability.


================

The last culprit would seem to be the bridge.

On the ABR-1 bridge, every now and then one of the saddle intonation screws will pop up out of it's little groove. This had happened to a 335 I bought for dirt cheap. The owner was tired of it going out of tune and gave me a great deal. Once I realized what the problem was, a little bit of pressure with a flat-bladed screw driver to the screw head popped it back into place. Absolutely no problems since.

And remember, the ABR-1 screw heads are on the pickup side.

The Nashville bridge is more stable than the ABR-1, as a rule. I would remove it and inspect it very closely. There should be very little play in the saddles. Use a can of compressed air and a soft toothbrush to remove any dirt and dust. Look for broken or unseated screws, or any structural defects. The saddle tracks should be free of debris and clean. Look for plating defects. The saddles should have only ONE string groove.

There should be very little play (wobble) in the posts as the sit in the sockets. If there is play, use a very tiny amount of plumber's Teflon tape around the threads of the posts. Make sure the bridge posts are nice and round and not bent. Roll them on a table and check for eccentricity. (Happened to one of mine.) The sockets that the posts fit into should be tight in the body.


================

Good idea to keep an eye on humidity this time of year. What with the cold weather, it's easy to turn the heat up and over-dry your guitars. This won't usually cause a problem with one string going out of tune, but it's that old "ounce of prevention" adage.


================

There is always the possibility of a high fret, etc., but they usually don't have these kinds of symptoms. Still, using a straight-edge on the fingerboard might be a good thing to check.


================

That's all I got. I know that most of what I written is stuff you already know, so forgive me--but sometimes it's good to go back to the basics. My gut feeling is that this is either going to be a tuner problem or a bridge issue. These can be exasperating, so you do have my sympathy.

I wish you the best.

Bill

 

[Texas Blues]

That 'thang still ain't fixed?

Its been over a month.

For the love of God and all 'thangs holy please take that guitar to a tech.

And if it ain't the nut please just take it out to the back forty and put it out of its misery

with a 12 gauge shotgun.

A Les Paul should never have to suffer like that. :spabout

 

[garywright]

yeah ..what tex said ! ...wring its damn neck into submission ..time now ta quit fuckin round with it and show it who's the boss

 

[trapland]

Of my 5 Les Pauls, the G string gives me trouble on ALL of them. It's been a problem in every LP I've ever owned. It goes flat. Sometimes really flat. For me, its always the nut and the fact that I wank the hell outta that string. I've gotten better at tuning while playing. The best fix for me is graphite in the slot, mostly cuz I never remember to buy secret sauce.