"Stop using pedals with P-90s"

[goldtop0]

I would ALWAYS ditch the pedals if I could play loud enough, but when I'm gigging a 5E3 Deluxe and getting notes from the bartender to turn it down, I need a pedal.

Good lord, the venues our band plays(rock'n'roll clubs etc in large halls generally) I usually have my PR 1x12 on about 2.75............got to use a boost pedal now and then.
ES 330 and R6
It's much quieter than when I practice(sans pedals) at home

 

[Any Name You Wish]

Caveat Emptor - "For recording use only"

Sorry man. That is indeed a very cool rig (I had to look it up). I've spent some time and money trying to find a low watt amp that does it all, clean and driven and in band or home practice, and always revert back to the 35-40 watt amp with a drive pedal (Origin Effects Revival w/'59 Bassman my favorite). I also cannot afford anymore hearing loss

 

[ourmaninthenorth]

Sorry man. That is indeed a very cool rig (I had to look it up). I've spent some time and money trying to find a low watt amp that does it all, clean and driven and in band or home practice, and always revert back to the 35-40 watt amp with a drive pedal (Origin Effects Revival w/'59 Bassman my favorite). I also cannot afford anymore hearing loss

Thanks for that Pal.

I think a natural development of this thread is this age old conundrum of how to get driven tones out of amps in a home/noise limited setting without going deaf/divorced/evicted.

My extremely expensive falling down the rabbit holes started with attenuators, trying to get sub 100 watters ( particularly a 73 Hiwatt DR103 - a bloody battleship and one of my favourites ) to behave themselves whilst not having a two mile fly exclusion zone around me proved somewhat elusive. Regardless of what the cognoscenti stated, they never felt or sounded the same to me. So I binned that idea in favour of slightly less powerful amps, 28 - 50 watts, still the same problem, the only way to get them overdriven was to turn em up. All just guitar into amp, using guitars volume controls to clean up, tap into drive.

My next port of call was to stick a pedal in front of one of the lower watters just at clipping, and control the overall volume using the pedal - example a Matamp GT1/ Matchless Chieftain at 50 watts with a Cornish SS3 - beautiful tones but still felt a little strangled to my ears. I felt the tones that I was after were in the amp alone, but I just couldn't get them out at manageable volume. I got stuck for a few years in a never ending cycle of buying and selling pedals, knowing full well I wasn't solving the initial brief.

Then someone turned me on to a British builder called Audio Kitchen who were joining the ever increasing list of amp makers toying with smaller wattage amps, and whilst in the process of buying one of their Little Choppers, The Emery Sounds Microbaby came across my bow, I bought it and was immediately aware that this was as near to a solution as I'd ever been. I simply could not believe how perfect the tone of the thing was at very very low watts and a 10 inch open backed cab - guitar straight in beautiful rich cleans, twist of the guitar vol, rich harmonic overdrive, all at volumes that were manageable. I didn't turn my big guns on again, and sold them over time.

Worth mentioning that all of the above relates to home playing, and experiences of band musicians will differ - it really is tools for the job.

At the moment I'm using two amps. A Matchless Little Monster 9 watter - a little too loud hence the pedals I'm holding ( back to square one - will i ever bloody learn? ) and a very low watt Audio Kitchen The Big Trees into an Alnico Creamback. I think I've got the best of both worlds.

So to end this rather long diatribe - I've gone down the road of using very low watt amps turned up and getting full juice, rather than sticking with the behemoths and having to turn them down and only getting a dribble of the juice in em.

I'd love to hear what others are doing.

 

[ampdan]

I prefer to not use pedals if possible. So, it's the "right tool for the job".
The amps I use are from 5 watts to 35 watts. You need the amp to be "singing"
at the volume level you can play at. I would (and do) rather have multiple amps
and 1 guitar, than multiple guitars and 1 amp. YMMV blah blah.

 

[renderit]

Thanks for that Pal.

I think a natural development of this thread is this age old conundrum of how to get driven tones out of amps in a home/noise limited setting without going deaf/divorced/evicted.

My extremely expensive falling down the rabbit holes started with attenuators, trying to get sub 100 watters ( particularly a 73 Hiwatt DR103 - a bloody battleship and one of my favourites ) to behave themselves whilst not having a two mile fly exclusion zone around me proved somewhat elusive. Regardless of what the cognoscenti stated, they never felt or sounded the same to me. So I binned that idea in favour of slightly less powerful amps, 28 - 50 watts, still the same problem, the only way to get them overdriven was to turn em up. All just guitar into amp, using guitars volume controls to clean up, tap into drive.

My next port of call was to stick a pedal in front of one of the lower watters just at clipping, and control the overall volume using the pedal - example a Matamp GT1/ Matchless Chieftain at 50 watts with a Cornish SS3 - beautiful tones but still felt a little strangled to my ears. I felt the tones that I was after were in the amp alone, but I just couldn't get them out at manageable volume. I got stuck for a few years in a never ending cycle of buying and selling pedals, knowing full well I wasn't solving the initial brief.

Then someone turned me on to a British builder called Audio Kitchen who were joining the ever increasing list of amp makers toying with smaller wattage amps, and whilst in the process of buying one of their Little Choppers, The Emery Sounds Microbaby came across my bow, I bought it and was immediately aware that this was as near to a solution as I'd ever been. I simply could not believe how perfect the tone of the thing was at very very low watts and a 10 inch open backed cab - guitar straight in beautiful rich cleans, twist of the guitar vol, rich harmonic overdrive, all at volumes that were manageable. I didn't turn my big guns on again, and sold them over time.

Worth mentioning that all of the above relates to home playing, and experiences of band musicians will differ - it really is tools for the job.

At the moment I'm using two amps. A Matchless Little Monster 9 watter - a little too loud hence the pedals I'm holding ( back to square one - will i ever bloody learn? ) and a very low watt Audio Kitchen The Big Trees into an Alnico Creamback. I think I've got the best of both worlds.

So to end this rather long diatribe - I've gone down the road of using very low watt amps turned up and getting full juice, rather than sticking with the behemoths and having to turn them down and only getting a dribble of the juice in em.

I'd love to hear what others are doing.

This.

Same.

So the OTHER rabbit hole I went down (and still use) is the 'speaker modeler' (load box) side.

First a Mesa Cab clone then a Two Notes Torpedo.

I think it kinda works better in that at least you can drive the amp then control the output (in my case through headphones).

But I needed a way to get the impedances right so I added a Weber Z-Matcher for those amps which differ from the load box in.

Does it work?

Yes.

Is it PERFECT?

No.

But now I can use big iron without shattering all the glass for a half mile...

 

[corpse]

There is really something to be said for 6L6's or EL34's just gasping air- screaming for their very lives. That said, I have been happy with lower wattage <35W Fenders- motivated with pedals.. Everything does not operate at the optimum, I am certain, but my ears ring bad enough without the added db-damage. And during band rehearsal, I wear eargasm plugs.
I cannot be too careful.
Don't fuck with your ears- tinnitus comes on without warning, and the damage is cumulative. And the ringing is nasty.
Enjoy.

 

[ampdan]

Don't fuck with your ears- tinnitus comes on without warning, and the damage is cumulative. And the ringing is nasty.
Enjoy.

Absolutely! Band practice in small spaces gave me mine. I blame the drummer
crashing cymbals 3 feet from my head for hours on end. Wind noise riding motorcycles doesn't help either.

 

[SG Std]

Not sure if anyone has tried one of these--the VOX 'Classic Rock' amPlugin. I found it on Amazon 2 weeks ago so I ordered it and for me it works great! Sounds like a loud classic Marshall but with the headphones along with a great volume control, it can be very 'quiet' thru the headphones, but yet still has the great classic Marshall tones. The 'volume sweep' on it is excellent as it can get unbearable loud but I am trying to protect my hearing [though I am too late with that!] so I adjust the Plugin's volume accordingly and though the volume is low thru the headphones, it still sounds great w/ nice overdrive, adjustable distortion/gain, with real nice sustain.

There is one 'negative' with it for me but nothing that will ever stop me from loving this little $43.00 'amp'!

If you scroll down in the 1st link, you will see that there quite a few models available--both in the 'Amp 2' models as well as the updated/newer 'Amp 3' models along with some nice features in each model.

And also there are some nice 'sound demos' of each VOX headphone amp within the VOX link.

Here's the 2 links about it:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NAUE7QU?ref_=ppx_hzod_title_dt_b_fed_asin_title_0_0&th=1

amPlug 2 - Vox Amps

VOX amPlug 2 Guitar/Bass Headphone Amplifiers

voxamps.com

 

[mdubya]

I think it is weird that anyone feels any kind of special virtue by not using pedals.

Jimi and Jimmy and Iommi and Beck all must feel some kind of shame for not being as righteous as you straight in types.

 

[Xpensive Wino]

I think it is weird that anyone feels any kind of special virtue by not using pedals.

Jimi and Jimmy and Iommi and Beck all must feel some kind of shame for not being as righteous as you straight in types.

"Virtue" is a social construct.

 

[mdubya]

"Virtue" is a social construct.

My lack of virtue is fact.

 

[Xpensive Wino]

My lack of virtue is fact.

 

[charliechitlins]

I think it is weird that anyone feels any kind of special virtue by not using pedals.

Jimi and Jimmy and Iommi and Beck all must feel some kind of shame for not being as righteous as you straight in types.

But Angus is flashing the horns!

 

[mdubya]

But Angus is flashing the horns!

Solo Dallas Fil swears Angus owes it all to the boost he got from his wireless unit.

Even "I never used pedals" EVH (flanger, Phase 90, etc...) got a boost from the preamp of his Echoplex.

 

[jb_abides]

Solo Dallas Fil swears Angus owes it all to the boost he got from his wireless unit.

Even "I never used pedals" EVH (flanger, Phase 90, etc...) got a boost from the preamp of his Echoplex.

Somebody Set Us Up The Bomb!

 

[Blind Lemon Chicken]

I've seen AC/DC since the very early days. Angus don't need nothing..

 

[Hiwatts-n-Gibsons]

Solo Dallas Fil swears Angus owes it all to the boost he got from his wireless unit.

Even "I never used pedals" EVH (flanger, Phase 90, etc...) got a boost from the preamp of his Echoplex.

This is such a real thing. Don't get me wrong, I love plugging straight into my Hiwatt, but goosing the front end with the tube preamp in my Fulltone TTE adds a gorgeous harmonic richness to the tone that takes it to the next level.

 

[mdubya]

This is such a real thing. Don't get me wrong, I love plugging straight into my Hiwatt, but goosing the front end with the tube preamp in my Fulltone TTE adds a gorgeous harmonic richness to the tone that takes it to the next level.

My own experience is that my 1976 Marshall 2204 sounded pure when plugged straight in. But in a mix (even when I was the only guitar player) really required something to push it in order to stand out (particularly for lead playing).

I used a Maestro MFZ-1 and a Vox 847 to great effect for many years. These would push an already molten amp straight off the cliff and into the stratosphere.


These days my rhythm playing is much cleaner and used as a backdrop for lead playing (not that I am particularly talented at any of it). A gain stage or (preferably two) from pedals is truly satisfying for me.

Fuzz with a boost is my favorite lead tone.

 

[J T]

...

Fuzz with a boost is my favorite lead tone.

Oh you do that too?
Here's my version.

 

[ourmaninthenorth]

I'm a huge fan of Stu Castledine's work.

His take on a 73 Rams Head, the V2, is a very very firm favourite.