Thumbwheels Matter!

[tdarian]

Hey everyone, I swapped out the stock Steel thumbwheels on my 2011 R7 for some brass wheels sourced from here:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brass-ABR-1...626?pt=Guitar_Accessories&hash=item19cf0d6f82

I thought the unwound strings were too bright and without enough "body" relative to the wound strings with the stock hardware. Removing the stock Thumbwheels and replacing them with the brass wheels was immediately recognizable and seemed to provide the perfect balance on my guitar. All of the harsh "siblants" were pretty much removed and the resulting tone is round and bell-like. I did not hear a big difference with the unwound strings...the whole thing just seems better balanced now.

This was a pretty good change for this guitar. I've read about folks replacing their stock ABR1s with aftermarket offerings, however I would advise anyone who wants to warm up the unwound strings to try the brass wheels first. It is cheap, and it is very easy to do.

 

[AndrewSimon]

Yes, anything that has to do with vibration transfer to the body
(like TP, TP post, TP bushings, ABR, ABR post and wheels)
will have a fundamental effect on the guitar tone.

The key is to find the right balance so the summed up effect
will yield the wanted results.

Personally I use the RetroSpec vintage this wheels
http://retrospec-guitar.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=4&products_id=28
but for the posts I did the MapleFlame mod with Nickle plated Brass.

:dude:

 

[Triburst]

I mentioned this not too long ago on another thread. This is the cheapest "warm-up" for a bright guitar you can do. The oddest thing is that you need brass thumb-wheels (to replace the steel ones) and you need steel studs (to replace the brass ones)! The fix is simple -- Just screw the steel stud into the old bushing -- I know the Retrospec ones fit fine, and it is incredible how well this brought the string vibrations on down from the neck joint (where they seemed to be loudest on this guitar) to right over the pickups (where it made it sound absolutely great).:headbange

 

[tdarian]

I did make a secondary change after the thumbwheels, and that was to replace the stock on this guitar (2011 Wildwood Spec R7) TonePros locking tailpiece studs with a set of longs in steel that I got from Retrospec. The Retrospec studs fit perfectly, and they are snug enough around the tailpiece that they function as lockers pretty much and are way easier to height adjust than the TonePros. It sure seems like overall sustain went up noticeably but that could be in my head although I doubt that.

With the two changes I've been able to get the action lower than I had it set before and still get the tone I want and with a clear ringing note.

At this point it would take a great deal of curiousity for me to try any other parts because this guitar now has "my voice" and I'm good.

Thanks for the suggestion Triburst, I know I read your take on all of this and based upon that the Thumbwheels were the initial and most important change.

 

[goldtop0]

What do you reckon double thumbwheels does to the tone?

 

[FretsAlot]

I don't wish to argue with your results but I would ask you what the status of your intonation was before and after you did the work. I ask because I recently changed out the vol/tone pots my my '04 R7 for RS Guitarworks's 550K+ ones. As has been previously reported, the guitar sounded icepicky afterwards. I noticed something about playing thirds & fifths at or above the 12th fret, so when I double-checked & adjusted the intonation, much of the shrill, ice-picky highs went away. Now the guitar is what I would call bright. Also... I readjusted the pickups because it was adjusted for before the pot swap. With the guitar freshly intonated and the pickups readjusted, it is just bright - not shrill or icepick'y.

Fretsalot/Scott

 

[tdarian]

Intonation was fine before and is now after I reset/adjusted after the swap.

 

[garywright]

I mentioned this not too long ago on another thread. This is the cheapest "warm-up" for a bright guitar you can do. The oddest thing is that you need brass thumb-wheels (to replace the steel ones) and you need steel studs (to replace the brass ones)!

not true ...you can also do fine with brass studs ..it depends on the individual guitar.

 

[gypsyseven]

I have to try some, but unfortunately they're sold out in Philly....

 

[Gold Tone]

Can't stand the new steel thumbwheels...WTF Gibson?!??!?! You had it right for decades then you switch to steel? If it was for a more vintage accurate shape ans size...well that didn't happen did it? :rolleyes

I swapped for the proper brass wheels on recent 6 purchases: 2 R9's, Firebird, L5, Black Beauty, SG

 

[Triburst]

not true ...you can also do fine with brass studs ..it depends on the individual guitar.

I should have mentioned "to more closely match the hardware on vintage bursts." You're right, Gary -- if you happen to have a really, REALLY bright guitar, you MIGHT want to keep the brass studs in there, but I have yet to personally hear a Les Paul of any flavor that didn't improve from steel studs. (And my '68 Custom was (like many ebony-boarded customs) very bright. Now, it just rings like a bell! I love it.)

 

[goldtop0]

What do you reckon double thumbwheels does to the tone?

So I take it that none of you guys have doubled up:wah

 

[TM1]

I use to do this on every T-O-M guitar I own. I found that it actually dampens the vibrations. In this case, Less is more. Easy to try, but I wouldn't use double thumb wheels again.

 

[goldtop0]

Thanks for that TM1.

 

[59Vampire]

How do you determine if what's on the guitar are brass or steel? They are plated.

 

[Gold Tone]

I use to do this on every T-O-M guitar I own. I found that it actually dampens the vibrations. In this case, Less is more. Easy to try, but I wouldn't use double thumb wheels again.

Same result here. My main gigging guitar ('99 R9) had double wheels for a few years. On a string change thought I'd pull the extra wheels to see if there was a difference...WOW...noticeably nicer sounding with the single wheels. The guitar didn't ring as nicely with the double wheels.

 

[Triburst]

How do you determine if what's on the guitar are brass or steel? They are plated.

Easiest way is a magnet.

 

[59Vampire]

Easiest way is a magnet.

So obvious that I'm smacking myself:3zone Thanks

 

[Gold Tone]

you can see the difference in the new wheels. They are smaller diameter than the previous brass ones (smaller than any wheels...Gibson or retrofit) and the knurling is very coarse compared to any other wheels. They are very obvious...they sit nicely in my trash can :rofl

...or a magnet

 

[Black58]

Ol' school tone STARTS with ol' school hardware.
Pickups 'n amps will NOT give ya exactly what wasn't there, in the FIRST place. :ganz