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1958 Flying V just listed on Reverb

AlienVintage

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Anyone come across this one before? Or knows anything about its history?

I just Googled the serial, and the only thing I could find was this ‘58 Skylark lap steel listing that (at least according to the description) has the same serial number:

 

AlienVintage

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Same photos on their website, if anyone wants to see them there.

They are very interesting.

 
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seafood

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if it is real. why is it only $425,000.00?.........hmmmmmm?
 
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zacknorton

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There's one benefit from not being able to even consider spending that kind of $$$ on a guitar: I don't have to worry if it's legit or not. 😆
 

Mr. Legit

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It is incredibly clean, and $425,000 seems a little low for what most people predict these to be. What I am curious about is the case because the interior is red. Aren't these supposed to be the normal Lifton style brown with pink? How do we know these cases were made by Geib? So many questions!

BTW: It looks like the OG ABR-1 saddles have been swapped, and the screw for the high E string has been changed. I don't know if it my eye sight playing tricks on me, but it also looks like the tuner buttons have been replaced. They don't mention any of these things in the ad.
 
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Wally

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I know nothing except I watched a world-respected authority on those guitars askmpermision to look at a V that a shop from L.A. had at a show one time. He pulled the truss Rod cover off, put it right back on, thanked the fellows, and we walked back to his booth. He knew from the truss rod cavity size and shape that it was a ‘clone’. Dan E. Had 8ntoduced me to this man at the show because I had a line on a V, which was for real. It had issues in that the neck had been repaired in the ‘60s. It carried a hand stamped 1964 number on the back of the headstock, and the Gibsonmlogo had been installed upside down after that factory repair. I still wish I could have bought it, but the owner consigned to Gruhn. If he would have taken the cash from me and my partner, he would have realized more money. This was maybe 27-28 years ago.
There were two new Flying Vs received at a dealer in Plainview, TX When they were introduced. I know this because my guitar teacher worked there at the time. He said they could not give them away.
 

Mr. Legit

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I was also going to post about the saddles, when I saw your post. Aren´t they supposed to have a small flat "ledge" on top?. To me they also look a little too shiny under the gold, as if they are chromed and not nickel plated.
From my own understanding from having done some plating myself, in order for gold/chrome plating to be adhered to a metal surface, there has to be some sort of plating to protect the bare metal underneath. That wear is normal because gold wears easily and exposes the under plating. The process is usually copper, nickel, then gold or chrome, but for this time period, it would have just been nickel then the gold plating.

You are right though, they are supposed to be flat on top not pointed. Even the Historic saddles are flatter on top than this, so I have ruled out that they are Historic replacements. The screw on the high E string looks like it belongs to a wired bridge. Even the strap buttons look to be plated in chrome. Gibson didn't start using chrome plating on its instruments until 1964. As a 1958, they should be nickel plated brass. In addition, to my eyes, the person who replaced the tuner buttons utilized "snot green" tuner buttons which weren't even installed with the same distance from the housing as each other. The brass tailpiece is also dead center which usually isn't the case with vintage 50's Flying V's, and they are usually a little off. However, there is a lot of inconsistency with the Modernistic guitars so it is difficult to give a definitive answer, but we aren't provided much detail about this guitar's history.

I'm not an expert nor do I claim to be, but in the grand scheme of things, if I was about to drop 425K on a highly coveted vintage guitar, I would like to know every single change down to each screw that took place especially if the store is claiming originality. These give me red flags about this guitar and why it might not be priced where it should be.

I feel somewhat comfortable in saying this beautiful guitar is a forgery. Buyer beware.
 
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AlienVintage

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I’ve never even held an original ‘58 V in my hands. So, please take these comments with a grain of salt. Or disregard completely, if you prefer.

But I’ve held hundreds of ‘50s Gibsons and owned dozens of them in my life.

I’ve never seen a serial number that looks quite like that. It looks like two different size fonts to me. This is apart from the fact that there is apparently a ‘58 Skylark lap steel with this same serial number (at least, according to that Skylark listing, posted earlier above).

Another thing that catches my eye is the radius cut of the pickguard, for the cutouts for both pickups. The way that pickguards were radiused for the pickup cutouts is another pretty consistent thing across all ‘50s Gibsons.

Please correct me if you think I am wrong about these observations.
 
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