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Help with info for 69/70 Les Paul?

Blessed

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Aug 8, 2021
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Hello everyone! I’m trying to get an exact/rough date for my mates 69/70Les Paul, I’ll post pictures and as much information as I can below.

Cherry Sunburst Finish
Closed B and O, dotted I on headstock
Transitional Tennon
No Volute
No “Made In USA” stamp.
Serial is 730319 ( Comes up as a 70-72, but also comes up as a 66-69).
3pc Pancake (cross branded body)
Gibson Tuners
Pots look original but codes are either covered with solder or need a little clean
Center seamed


Other bits!
Equipped with P90’s but has the MHB bar in pickup cavity’s? So its a Deluxe?
Neck looks to be 3 pc but unsure if thats not just the “wings”?

Any help with dating is much appreciated, or any extra information about the guitar itself!

many thanks all! :)
 

Blessed

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2DC23BA2-24CB-4B85-B2EB-1E019F91B1D9.jpeg
 

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Blessed

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72-73 refinished back with volute removed. Nice 2 piece top
Many thanks for the info, what are the indicators that the backs been refinished?

and also if it’s a 72/73 should it not have the “Made In USA” stamp?
 

guitplayer

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Mar 8, 2008
Messages
1,874
Those should have a bursted back and neck. Logo is like the one
on the right (which is a 1971-mid73) the one on left is 73- maybe 77.
CC has the wiring channel in the center ,which is transition from top to bottom.
Might be a 73.
 

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Definitely a 3pieces neck.
The very unusual 2 pieces birds-eye maple top, its center seam, the shape of the top around the edges, the finish checking along the maple grain, the shape of the sunburst and is lack of on the back suggest a veneered Gold Top with the top refinished sunburst.
Close-up pics would be needed to confirm (or infirm).
 

sweiger

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Also it looks to me like the headstock has been shaved down to try & match 50's size headstock..
[disclaimer: It could be the pic that decieves.. hmm]

Bridge p.u. is Seymor Duncan.
 
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Wilko

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Hard to say the exact year as someone went through a lot of trouble trying to make look like a burst.

Top is most likely a veneer. rounded over edges and the fact that it's a center seem on a pancake body.

Headstock is deffinitely messed with. sides trimmed in without bothering to move the tuners in. Volute was removed at that time.

that neck joint make me think 70 at the earliest. could be late as 74
 

sweiger

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1,099
Many thanks for the info, what are the indicators that the backs been refinished?

and also if it’s a 72/73 should it not have the “Made In USA” stamp?
The stamp was most likely removed when the neck and headstock was 'reworked'.
 
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Blessed

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Many thanks all for the info and contributions.

i’ll get some more close up photos of the body and head stock.

i’ve got a black light arriving today too

is there any angle/part that would be best/most helpful!
 

Blessed

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Definitely a 3pieces neck.
The very unusual 2 pieces birds-eye maple top, its center seam, the shape of the top around the edges, the finish checking along the maple grain, the shape of the sunburst and is lack of on the back suggest a veneered Gold Top with the top refinished sunburst.
Close-up pics would be needed to confirm (or infirm).
I’ll upload some today, any specific part or just close up of the body?
 

Blessed

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Hard to say the exact year as someone went through a lot of trouble trying to make look like a burst.

Top is most likely a veneer. rounded over edges and the fact that it's a center seem on a pancake body.

Headstock is deffinitely messed with. sides trimmed in without bothering to move the tuners in. Volute was removed at that time.

that neck joint make me think 70 at the earliest. could be late as 74
Many thanks Wilko! I’ll put some more photos up today!
 

Blessed

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The stamp was most likely removed when the neck and headstock was 'reworked'.
Gotcha! Would this show up on the black light too? I’m aware the body would if its been refinished but unsure of the neck?
 

Triplet

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Something refinned that long ago will prolly blacklight fairly evenly. I don' think it's worth the time.
 

Blessed

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Gotcha, i’ll check once it arrives, I managed to get a few closer photos earlier, do they offer anymore insight? I’ll also get some photos of the neck & headstock too.

cheers again all, some great minds and insight!
 

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Close-up pics of the top along the fingerboard, close-ups of the top's edges and close-ups of the maple inside pickups cavities could help to confirm what looks very much like a veneerd top.
 

Wally

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I am no expert but have a lot of years looking at Gibsons…since the early ‘60s. That was does not look original and correct from here.
 

brandtkronholm

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+1 on the possibility of a veneer top.
Looking at the underside of the maple top through the control cavity picture, it looks like there is a seam between two original pieces of maple. (It could also be an artifact of overspray or (re)finishing the guitar.)
Better pictures of the control cavity, pickup selector cavity, and pickup cavities that show the maple top would be revealing. (As said by poor man's burst in reply #16.)
I don't think I know enough to comment on the status of the headstock or neck. I cannot tell by the pictures if it has a three-piece neck.

I think it looks cool! There's a deep '70s vibe with the funky cracks/checking on the top.
 

Wally

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I think the ‘checking’ on the top looks more like veneer that has lifted. Whatever the cause, imho that top needs work.
 
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