P.A.F. Pickup Height Adjustment Video

[Mars Hall]

My tried-and-true starting point for PAF-ish style HBs with an A3n/A2b mag set is 2.4mm for the bridge p'up and 4.3mm for the neck p'up. IME, the "sweet spot" is never farther away than a whole turn of the height screw.

In the video, Jon is taking his measurements from the top of the pole screw. Is your measurement the same or from the top of the cover/bobbin?

 

[marshall1987]

I wonder how much time and effort guitar greats such as Jimmy Page, Billy Gibbons, Duane Allman, and Eric Clapton put in to adjusting the PAFs on their Les Pauls in order to find the "sweet spot"? You think they spent hours dialing in their PAFs?

 

[LtKojak]

I wonder how much time and effort guitar greats such as Jimmy Page, Billy Gibbons, Duane Allman, and Eric Clapton put in to adjusting the PAFs on their Les Pauls in order to find the "sweet spot"? You think they spent hours dialing in their PAFs?

All the big names have capable techs doing the setup for them, whom are more than fairly economically compensated.

If you work for hours without yet to find the "sweet spot", you either don't know how or what to look for or are simply tone deaf.

 

[johnnyslim]

Certainly a good thread and video. I have learned over time to trust my ears using my amps. My "sweet spot" is far closer to the strings than this video. I have PAF's in my conversions and it is my observation a slight adjustment on a PAF will have a more noticeable tone effect than the same slight adjustment on a production humbucker. Not too familiar with boutique pickups but I would guess these are somewhere in between.

Nothing new here. The sweet spot is different on every guitar.

 

[Classicplayer]

Certainly a good thread and video. I have learned over time to trust my ears using my amps. My "sweet spot" is far closer to the strings than this video. I have PAF's in my conversions and it is my observation a slight adjustment on a PAF will have a more noticeable tone effect than the same slight adjustment on a production humbucker. Not too familiar with boutique pickups but I would guess these are somewhere in between.

Nothing new here. The sweet spot is different on every guitar.

Different per each guitar, yes. Although looking at my pickups on my 2108 Traditional and my 2000 Classic; the pickup height view ( just eyeballin' them) looks to be quite similar. Measuring with a U.S. nickel and or nickel with a penny is close to being the same for each guitar.

I choose to do the final tweaks by ear with the amp I use the most and with a bit of gain dialed in. For me this seems to work better than relying on a clean-toned amp.



Classicplayer

 

[marshall1987]

All the big names have capable techs doing the setup for them, whom are more than fairly economically compensated.

If you work for hours without yet to find the "sweet spot", you either don't know how or what to look for or are simply tone deaf.[/QUOTE]

Watch it Kojak! Who are you calling tone deaf? :dang

You want to retract that statement?

 

[LtKojak]

Watch it Kojak! Who are you calling tone deaf? :dang

You want to retract that statement?

That "you" was not "you personally", but as a generally speaking statement.

As an experienced moonlightning guitar tech, for the sake of discussing the subject, say, I've installed a new set of p'ups in a LP. Ok, after setting'em to my guideline initial setup starting point, I usually find the "sweet spot" of my liking in just a few minutes. Adjusting the polepiece stagger for string output evenness takes about fifteen minutes.

When I do it for a client, it might take longer, as of course we both hear things differently and I have to follow instructions to "fine-tune" after what the client wants, so it takes as long as it takes... altough now that I think of it, in several hundred of jobs done, I can barely remember a couple of times when I was asked I had to slighly re-adjust the settings in the delivered instrument. In both cases were Djent players, that can I remember.

Well, it comes with the territory, and it's healthy to have somebody challenging your take when there are specific reasons for it, and that you can anyway deliver what's asked. You can learn from both the sacred and the profane, if you're willing to listen everybody's POVs.

However, if somebody spend hours and hours without finding it, well... all I can say is, get a pro to do it for you and ask him/her permission to watch the process being done, so you can visually learn the ropes too.

Yours very truly,

 

[corpse]

I wonder how much time and effort guitar greats such as Jimmy Page, Billy Gibbons, Duane Allman, and Eric Clapton put in to adjusting the PAFs on their Les Pauls in order to find the "sweet spot"? You think they spent hours dialing in their PAFs?

Hey LT- what was Jimmy's tech name when they made LZ2? How about Eric's when they were doing the Beano album? I am a believer that they looked for guitars with "that sound".
That said, when I have done the PUP height adjustment exercise I almost always end up about exactly where I started, as sounding the best.

 

[marshall1987]

That "you" was not "you personally", but as a generally speaking statement.

As an experienced moonlightning guitar tech, for the sake of discussing the subject, say, I've installed a new set of p'ups in a LP. Ok, after setting'em to my guideline initial setup starting point, I usually find the "sweet spot" of my liking in just a few minutes. Adjusting the polepiece stagger for string output evenness takes about fifteen minutes.

When I do it for a client, it might take longer, as of course we both hear things differently and I have to follow instructions to "fine-tune" after what the client wants, so it takes as long as it takes... altough now that I think of it, in several hundred of jobs done, I can barely remember a couple of times when I was asked I had to slighly re-adjust the settings in the delivered instrument. In both cases were Djent players, that can I remember.

Well, it comes with the territory, and it's healthy to have somebody challenging your take when there are specific reasons for it, and that you can anyway deliver what's asked. You can learn from both the sacred and the profane, if you're willing to listen everybody's POVs.

However, if somebody spend hours and hours without finding it, well... all I can say is, get a pro to do it for you and ask him/her permission to watch the process being done, so you can visually learn the ropes too.

Yours very truly,

The word "hours" was not to be taken literally. However, if you own 10 or more guitars with humbucking pickups, as many owners do on this forum, you could end up spending hours trying to find the sweet spot on all those pickups, especially if you're in the habit of micro-analyzing pickup height with a machinist's rule down to the millimeter, while simultaneously doing a listening test. What's all the fuss about?

I stand by my earlier statement, I doubt the Classic Rock guitarists and their road techs back in the day put much effort into finding the "sweet spot" with their PAFs. And I doubt they used a machinist's rule. Don't tell me Jimmy Page, Duane Allman, Billy Gibbons, and Eric Clapton didn't set up and adjust their own guitars when not on tour. Of course they did!

I've been setting my pickup height by eye for decades and like my tone just fine. Of course having formal education in University Physics helps a lot. :wow

 

[LtKojak]

I've been setting my pickup height by eye for decades and like my tone just fine. Of course having formal education in University Physics helps a lot. :wow

I'm happy for you. After all, only you would know what good sounds like.

I'm not sure what is the point you're trying to make, bringing "formal education" bit to the table, though.

 

[JonathanRyan]

hmmm

 

[JonathanRyan]

The word "hours" was not to be taken literally. However, if you own 10 or more guitars with humbucking pickups, as many owners do on this forum, you could end up spending hours trying to find the sweet spot on all those pickups, especially if you're in the habit of micro-analyzing pickup height with a machinist's rule down to the millimeter, while simultaneously doing a listening test. What's all the fuss about?

I stand by my earlier statement, I doubt the Classic Rock guitarists and their road techs back in the day put much effort into finding the "sweet spot" with their PAFs. And I doubt they used a machinist's rule. Don't tell me Jimmy Page, Duane Allman, Billy Gibbons, and Eric Clapton didn't set up and adjust their own guitars when not on tour. Of course they did!

I've been setting my pickup height by eye for decades and like my tone just fine. Of course having formal education in University Physics helps a lot. :wow

Totally agree with you. Of course having formal education in University Physics helps a lot. Education is generally very important.

 

[70`s Rocker]

As someone that's maintained a moonlightning guitar tech activity for over fifteen years, of all the things said and done in the video, the single most important statement that can't be stressed enough is the following: "a quarter turn of the height screw can make a difference", to which I'll add "a 1/4 turn of the screw can make or break the p'up's correct setup". The ever elusive "sweet spot" is REAL, and it shouldn't be overlooked as "myth" or "urban legend". It is very real, and it changes with every p'up, due to different winds, and magnets. My tried-and-true starting point for PAF-ish style HBs with an A3n/A2b mag set is 2.4mm for the bridge p'up and 4.3mm for the neck p'up. IME, the "sweet spot" is never farther away than a whole turn of the height screw.

Also, he talks about the pole screws' setting kinda secondary importance, as seems that the demograhic of most of Throbak customers/fans would judge the p'ups in single note OD soloing, the evidence might prove him right in saying so, but, nonetheless to most pro players, playing mostly clean and doing a lot of chordwork and/or arpeggio comping, the evenness of output between strings is of paramount importance, so I'll show a picture of how a NECK p'up's stagger should look like, being the 6th string on the left, after of being set up for evenness by ear. The consequent "pattern" could be used as starting point, fine-tuning it to the actual string set gauge and neck radius.



The bridge p'up, being in a very stable zone where the string almost doesn't move, the stagger doesn't need to be so accentuated, so as a starting point it should be set flat but the 4th string, which should be set higher than the rest for about 1.5 turns.

HTH,

I did this on my Gibson 50's standard and it sounds great! Thanks for sharing your wisdom.

 

[Classicplayer]

I did this on my Gibson 50's standard and it sounds great! Thanks for sharing your wisdom.

The pole piece stagger in the photo is about where I've set my neck humbuckers on each of my Les Pauls. Mine looks very similar, but are adjusted to what I think sounds correct for the guitar they reside in. My bridge pickups are adjusted for height and only maybe one pole piece to bring it into loudness witth others.

Classicplayer

 

[TM1]

There were Not any guitar tech's in the 50/60's that work for a band or even a name act. Pretty much everyone adjusted their own guitars. I never really saw anyone helping(or humping) guitars until I met up with the Allman Bros. Band in 1969. I'm sure there was as guys like The Beatles & Stones had a guy or two. Pretty much in those days you helped move your own stuff.

 

[RocknRollShakeUp]

What does everyone think of this guy’s take?