Singlecut '50s Specials vs. P90s '50s goldtops

[MisterMiniMite]

I've been searching for a player grade '50s goldtop but the singlecut '50s specials have me intrigued. With the same pickup/electronics configuration, the fretboard binding, the pearl headstock logo, etc., it really seems to me to be a '54 type gold top without the carved maple top, at a fraction of the cost. Is it even an interesting comparison, am i missing something, or am I way off?

 

[sunburst1]

Unless u absolutely can't live without a neck pup ... get ur self a single cut Junior... tone & price r hard to match... IMO..

 

[blauserk]

Get a '52, which should be in the ballpark of a special. Then take the original trapeze crossbar off it and put on one of the low-profile ones made by Joe Glaser or BCR Greg and others.

http://www.lespaulforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=172612

Maybe J45/kerry will weigh in. I know that in some of these threads he's discussed the tone of the goldtops versus the specials. Oh yes, and do a search for bluesforstevie's recordings of his old P90 goldtop through a blackface Deluxe Reverb.

 

[Jumping@Shadows]

I've had a number of both and for my taste i prefer the Specials you have a wider choice of neck profiles through '55-58 and they tend to be lighter weight and you can get them for less than re-issue money with little effort- up alongside '59-54 ES 345's these are the best bang-for-the-buck in vintage IMHO

 

[latestarter]

I've been using a player grade 56 special for gigs for 10 years and seriously, consider them as a very competent contender..

 

[LiamH]

To paraphrase the marvellous Gilvis:

If Gibson had actually listened to a few LP Specials, they would have realised there really wasn't any point in making the Sunburst Les Paul Standard. The Junior is great, but lacks a neck pickup. A good Special, is special...

So I bought one. Really light resonant one. '57. From Gilvis. Probably the best 2 pickup guitar I've ever played, just outrageous. I've played maybe 6 GTs, about 4 with P90s and 2 with Humbuckers. It would slay any of them.

IMHO

Liam

 

[sunburst1]

To paraphrase the marvellous Gilvis:

If Gibson had actually listened to a few LP Specials, they would have realised there really wasn't any point in making the Sunburst Les Paul Standard. The Junior is great, but lacks a neck pickup. A good Special, is special...

So I bought one. Really light resonant one. '57. From Gilvis. Probably the best 2 pickup guitar I've ever played, just outrageous. I've played maybe 6 GTs, about 4 with P90s and 2 with Humbuckers. It would slay any of them.

IMHO

Liam

Not to disagree ... the p-90's r aren't mounted the same.. Jr. has a dog ear & Special's don't .. Tone isn't the same, IMO... Never dug neck pup tone... Cool , but impractical to my style... Single pup guitars r just better... Blackguard Esquires & 50's single cut Juniors rule the tone world where I'm from... OMMV..

 

[JIMI55LP]

When compared to the wraptail GT, I believe you'll save a boatload of cash with the Special, not to mention your back! They don't sound the same, but they are close and don't sound bad in anyway. It's easy to say go try each and compare, but it's tuff to find them sitting next to each other for that test. If you feel you need everything the wraptail GT has to offer then the Special will fill the bill in a very nice way $.

 

[latestarter]

Never dug neck pup tone... ..

Wow, but we're all different and hear different things. The neck tone on my Spcecial is woody with bite, but still fat enough...totally usable.

 

[Litcrit]

A few years back Buzzy (Lark St music) had a ''54 GT that was reasonably priced. I took my '58 Special for comparison's sake, and it slayed the GT: no comparison. NOT subtle, it was night and day.
I walked out w/out the GT...

 

[yeti]

I have a very "special" '56 junior (old neck P-90 added) and it's great, having said that, I'd replace it with a good wraptail GT in a heartbeat if priced right. A good GT ( and I've never heard a bad one from the 50's) is the ultimate P-90 guitar for me. Side by side it's not even close. The maple cap makes a huge difference. Specials, juniors and all that are great but they are not in the same league to my ears.

 

[gilapagostortois]

Side by side it's not even close. The maple cap makes a huge difference. Specials, juniors and all that are great but they are not in the same league to my ears.

not mine. although the finest sounding solid body guitar i ever heard, did just happen to be a (THE) '54 goldtop.

 

[Three13]

not mine. although the finest sounding solid body guitar i ever heard, did just happen to be a (THE) '54 goldtop.

What became of it?

 

[gilapagostortois]

What became of it?

rutt row. I bet you didn't know you were signing up for capital letters when you ask that innocuous question. Duck... Speech typing rant imminent.

I'll begin at the end. Does anybody know where Steve's gold top is now? (Yeah, I know he had a million of 'em.) I'm guessing it won't be coming up for air any time, cheap.

I'm such a dip-shit for money... I've sold stuff that I had no business selling on many occasions when the money seemed right or better. (Although, fuck you Litcrit - I would not sell my grandmother). I sold it to a local DC area guy in 1984 after I had owned it for about six months.

I was lucky enough to get it back almost 10 years later. Not too long afterwards, a crew from upstate New York that included rockabilly Ralph:rip, fabulous Steve from sunrise guitars :rip, and three or four other fruitcakes came down to my store...as they would. A bunch of guitar dealing, fine dining, drinking (not Steve, though), and general silliness ensued... As it would. At the end of the Malay (and it really was kind of a Malay. At one point, the one notorious tire kicker in the pack, complained to Ralph about his amplified test driving being shut down by myself. Ralph ((tip of my hat to ya, buddy)) took exception, and the two ended up seriously dancing in front of my store. Ralph Ripped the guys toupee clean off. Bear in mind here... making stuff up, has never been my bailiwick)... Ralph somehow ended up with the gold top. I can't remember how (maybe it had something to do with the donnybrook... I really can't remember). That was kind of weird, because (A) Ralph was a Gretsch guy and (B) Steve had great ears. Before the two got in the car together to head out (up) I advised them both that there was no way in hell that Steve wasn't going to own the gold top before they got home. Steve actually took $50. action from me that he couldn't get Ralph to cough the guitar that night. The next time I saw saw Steve (in Philly), he handed me the $50. He offered me first refusal on the guitar, should he ever decide to sell it, but advised me not to hold my breath. More than fair enough.

Very shortly before he died, Steve called me to tell me that he had been offered cra cra crazy money for the guitar (close to double market for a near perfect example... and this one was re-fretted and very well hammered), but he was giving me my shot. He said he realized I c/wouldn't touch it for the price. He was right. He was one of the great ones.

 

[Three13]

Thanks, Gil - good history... Now someone just needs to find the guitar!

 

[blauserk]

Couple more threads addressing the subject:

http://www.lespaulforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=141697

http://www.lespaulforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=62149

 

[Three13]

Gil - have you ever seriously considered writing a book about your (mis)adventures with vintage guitars? Seems like the combination of experience, good stories and sense of humor would be a winner.

 

[mbowen]

Gil - have you ever seriously considered writing a book about your (mis)adventures with vintage guitars? Seems like the combination of experience, good stories and sense of humor would be a winner.

If he did i am afraid it would be go strait to Jail do not pass go.:wah:rofl:wahMike B.

 

[Three13]

Just check the statute of limitations carefully before admitting to anything naughty...

 

[Black58]

rutt row. I bet you didn't know you were signing up for capital letters when you ask that innocuous question. Duck... Speech typing rant imminent.

I'll begin at the end. Does anybody know where Steve's gold top is now? (Yeah, I know he had a million of 'em.) I'm guessing it won't be coming up for air any time, cheap.

I'm such a dip-shit for money... I've sold stuff that I had no business selling on many occasions when the money seemed right or better. (Although, fuck you Litcrit - I would not sell my grandmother). I sold it to a local DC area guy in 1984 after I had owned it for about six months.

I was lucky enough to get it back almost 10 years later. Not too long afterwards, a crew from upstate New York that included rockabilly Ralph:rip, fabulous Steve from sunrise guitars :rip, and three or four other fruitcakes came down to my store...as they would. A bunch of guitar dealing, fine dining, drinking (not Steve, though), and general silliness ensued... As it would. At the end of the Malay (and it really was kind of a Malay. At one point, the one notorious tire kicker in the pack, complained to Ralph about his amplified test driving being shut down by myself. Ralph ((tip of my hat to ya, buddy)) took exception, and the two ended up seriously dancing in front of my store. Ralph Ripped the guys toupee clean off. Bear in mind here... making stuff up, has never been my bailiwick)... Ralph somehow ended up with the gold top. I can't remember how (maybe it had something to do with the donnybrook... I really can't remember). That was kind of weird, because (A) Ralph was a Gretsch guy and (B) Steve had great ears. Before the two got in the car together to head out (up) I advised them both that there was no way in hell that Steve wasn't going to own the gold top before they got home. Steve actually took $50. action from me that he couldn't get Ralph to cough the guitar that night. The next time I saw saw Steve (in Philly), he handed me the $50. He offered me first refusal on the guitar, should he ever decide to sell it, but advised me not to hold my breath. More than fair enough.

Very shortly before he died, Steve called me to tell me that he had been offered cra cra crazy money for the guitar (close to double market for a near perfect example... and this one was re-fretted and very well hammered), but he was giving me my shot. He said he realized I c/wouldn't touch it for the price. He was right. He was one of the great ones.

Funny, I went up to Steve's, back in the day, to check out a '57 Special, after seeing a coupla shots of it in VG Magazine; No dice, it was gone. :dang .. A little while later, it somehow ended up at GC in Paramus, N.J. (I recognized the shape of the finish wear on the back!) and I tried and bought it! It was a GREAT one! :headbange