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Hey it's Mat from Gibson Product Development - AMA

Torshalla

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Sep 26, 2020
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145
Matt, now that we are closer to release and much info / rumors are circulating around… is there more you can share about the upcoming Greenie models?
- ML brazilian board model limited to 50 pcs? I guess this one will be aged to match exactly Greenie’s current aging? Signed by Kirk?
- ML indian board model non limited in numbers but limited to 2023? ML aged also? Same aging or different aging (if so how different)? Same guitar otherwise?
- pickups: i assume custom buckers wound to match Greenie’s in the best way?
- how do you guys see / plan the impact of these models on the valur of CC1 models (aged and VOS)?

I realize this may be too early or too sensitive… anyway let’s see what you can and cannot answer :)

Thanks again for taking the time to read our questions and answer them :)
 

matkoehler

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Sep 12, 2014
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Hey Mat! Thanks for still contributing to the thread. A few questions about 335’s:
-Did the 64’s block inlay material change these past year? They seem to be less yellow lately
-Are the black pickup rings still Cellulose Acetate Butyrate?
-Any clue when we should start seeing the new ABR bridges?
Thabks
Hey man!

1) No, but as that celluloid is made in batches, there is some variation as to the yellow content. We do make a concerted effort to match the color tone throughout the inlays as much as possible.

2) Yes, we only use the CAB rings with guitars using heights of Medium & XL. We use ABS on any models that take different heights (3PU models). Honestly it would be hard to tell them apart without examining underneath!

3) Hopefully soon, just waiting on the full first article inspection. I would guess by the end of the year.

Thanks for the questions.
 

matkoehler

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Sep 12, 2014
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Hey Mat, just played a USA Casino the other day and what a great guitar! Any plans for more US-made classic Epiphones? Such a great idea to bring Epi back to its glory.
Great to hear, they are stellar! Yes lots of plans. Also lots of long timelines. But we have stuff brewing, that's all I can say. And next year will be Epiphone 150th anniversary so expect a big focus on that. :)
 

matkoehler

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I didn't read the whole thread but here are a couple things I would like to see:

1- That Theodore guitar as a standard production limited run. I bought a Moderne when they came out again and I love it. The Theodore as a non CS would be amazing!

2- I had the opportunity to test a Firebird X for a week or two back when it was introduced. There was something very special about the way it interacted with direct recording/amp sims. While the guitar was radical and not widely accepted the technology for recording direct that it possessed worked incredibly well. The pickups also sounded nice through a regular amplifier.

Maybe that technology (just the pickups/direct recording option) could be built into something. I think so many people in their little bedrooms are using Guitar Rig and Amplitude that there would be a huge market for this. I know it's probably the only time I've been happy with an amp sim.

Other than that I think Gibson does a great job and I find myself way more loyal to the brand than any of the FMIC lines. I love Fender, Gretsch and Guild guitars but by making them so cheap (quality wise) and lowering the power of the brand I find myself loving the old ones and not buying the new ones. The fact that Gibson makes affordable* guitars made in America means a lot to me. Please don't offshore.

Thanks!

* Compared to FMIC, etc... models that are USA made Gibson offers some real bargains! They're not cheap but you can still get a Tribute, Junior, Studio, Special for about what a USA Stratocaster (that's probably made in Mexico and assembled here) costs.
1) I believe this was indeed discussed further back, and I agree. Working on it.
2) It was a technological marvel for the time but a major design fail IMO. Another case of good intentions gone wrong...thankfully present day Gibson does "fewer things better" and not "all of the things on everything".
3) Thanks for the kind words! And I completely agree. If you look at where some of our competitors' guitars are made at the same or similar price points, it gives you a new perspective.
 

Dport

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Nov 9, 2020
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I have been insanely busy, yes -- but also very confused where we are at with this thread. It really devolved as they tend to do after any length of time. But I definitely appreciate succinct, direct questions as I have trouble weeding through these.

I repeat what I said earlier. VOS and Murphy Lab are two separate things. But I see the confusion -- "Murphy Painted" is a Murphy Lab option. But it seems Wildwood worked out a deal where they have Tom Murphy paint their VOS M2M guitars for the same upcharge. If I was packing it, I would NOT have used the Murphy Lab COA booklets and I will address this with Custom Shop. Thanks.

Another point of clarification, I would not call the Murphy Lab lacquer self-aging. There is a tremendous amount of work spend both aging it and getting it to check in specific ways. :)
Mat,

Again, thank you so much for the time you put into this thread. I hate to continue to nitpick the question of Murphy Lab VOS/Gloss, but I must. Wildwood claims that the finish used on their Murphy Painted VOS guitars is the same ML lacquer used on the aged guitars.

I asked, "I’ve got a Wildwood Spec Murphy Lab Murphy Painted that I purchased from you last year. I love it. It’s great. I was wondering, I have the VOS finish…Is this the same Murphy Lab lacquer that is used for the aged finishes?"

A member of the Wildwood staff replied, "thank you for the email. All murphy lab guitars use the same lacquer!!! Have a great day and thank you for all you do for us."

The folks at Wildwood are great and not dogging on them at all here....but, this is incorrect?

Thanks!
 

matkoehler

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Joined
Sep 12, 2014
Messages
340
Matt, now that we are closer to release and much info / rumors are circulating around… is there more you can share about the upcoming Greenie models?
- ML brazilian board model limited to 50 pcs? I guess this one will be aged to match exactly Greenie’s current aging? Signed by Kirk?
- ML indian board model non limited in numbers but limited to 2023? ML aged also? Same aging or different aging (if so how different)? Same guitar otherwise?
- pickups: i assume custom buckers wound to match Greenie’s in the best way?
- how do you guys see / plan the impact of these models on the valur of CC1 models (aged and VOS)?

I realize this may be too early or too sensitive… anyway let’s see what you can and cannot answer :)

Thanks again for taking the time to read our questions and answer them :)
Hey there, thanks for the questions. I am not at liberty to disclose the specific run details yet; there is an embargo of information and assets until a set release time. But I can tell you that you're not super far off. These are completely different animals from that CC run...hyper-accurate level of detail and a lot of it specific to its more recent years of play wear. And it benefits from our new 3D scanning technology too. But I completely understand how a CC owner may not be pleased with more being made, and I raised those concerns but after seeing the language of the first CC release and comparing the previous aged version to the new Murphy Lab aging work, I am confident that it will have its own place and will only increase the value of the CC run.
 

Torshalla

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Sep 26, 2020
Messages
145
Hey there, thanks for the questions. I am not at liberty to disclose the specific run details yet; there is an embargo of information and assets until a set release time. But I can tell you that you're not super far off. These are completely different animals from that CC run...hyper-accurate level of detail and a lot of it specific to its more recent years of play wear. And it benefits from our new 3D scanning technology too. But I completely understand how a CC owner may not be pleased with more being made, and I raised those concerns but after seeing the language of the first CC release and comparing the previous aged version to the new Murphy Lab aging work, I am confident that it will have its own place and will only increase the value of the CC run.
Thanks for taking the time to answer Mat. Much appreciated :).
Fully understand that you cannot tell us more about the guitars… are you able to tell us when more will be announced / shared from Gibson?
I am looking forward to these coming out, I am sure they will be amazing!
 

rhye

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Jul 27, 2016
Messages
9
Hey man!

1) No, but as that celluloid is made in batches, there is some variation as to the yellow content. We do make a concerted effort to match the color tone throughout the inlays as much as possible.

2) Yes, we only use the CAB rings with guitars using heights of Medium & XL. We use ABS on any models that take different heights (3PU models). Honestly it would be hard to tell them apart without examining underneath!

3) Hopefully soon, just waiting on the full first article inspection. I would guess by the end of the year.

Thanks for the questions.
Thanks so much for your response Mat!

-Regarding the black M69's. I noticed that on the website they are labeled as "Black M69 Medium & Tall" on the '64 ES and for a '64 SG they are labeled "M69 Cellulose Acetate Butyrate". Are those different or would a '64 335 also be CAB?
-Were the black Black Top Hat knobs and truss covers also revised as part of the True Historic plastics?

Btw , I hope you continue doing videos such as the one you did with Dave Cobb. That one is awesome
Thanks again!
 

matkoehler

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Joined
Sep 12, 2014
Messages
340
Mat,

Again, thank you so much for the time you put into this thread. I hate to continue to nitpick the question of Murphy Lab VOS/Gloss, but I must. Wildwood claims that the finish used on their Murphy Painted VOS guitars is the same ML lacquer used on the aged guitars.

I asked, "I’ve got a Wildwood Spec Murphy Lab Murphy Painted that I purchased from you last year. I love it. It’s great. I was wondering, I have the VOS finish…Is this the same Murphy Lab lacquer that is used for the aged finishes?"

A member of the Wildwood staff replied, "thank you for the email. All murphy lab guitars use the same lacquer!!! Have a great day and thank you for all you do for us."

The folks at Wildwood are great and not dogging on them at all here....but, this is incorrect?

Thanks!
Love those guys. But they are incorrect. I will address with them. Thanks!
 

matkoehler

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Sep 12, 2014
Messages
340
Thanks so much for your response Mat!

-Regarding the black M69's. I noticed that on the website they are labeled as "Black M69 Medium & Tall" on the '64 ES and for a '64 SG they are labeled "M69 Cellulose Acetate Butyrate". Are those different or would a '64 335 also be CAB?
-Were the black Black Top Hat knobs and truss covers also revised as part of the True Historic plastics?

Btw , I hope you continue doing videos such as the one you did with Dave Cobb. That one is awesome
Thanks again!
Yeah again any model not using medium and extra tall would get ABS by default, so the '64 ES falls into that category. Thanks!
 

matkoehler

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Sep 12, 2014
Messages
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Archtop: Lefties too! I'll go L-5CES even if it's M2M only...
In time...keep in mind that for a guitar like this, it will require extensive tooling and fixturing and and whatnot. Rarely are we able to launch with lefties in general, but in general I feel we are remarkably accommodating to lefty players given we are not making modular/bolt on instruments. Always in our minds!
 

jb_abides

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Apr 6, 2005
Messages
3,253
In time...keep in mind that for a guitar like this, it will require extensive tooling and fixturing and and whatnot. Rarely are we able to launch with lefties in general, but in general I feel we are remarkably accommodating to lefty players given we are not making modular/bolt on instruments. Always in our minds!

Understand and thanks, just keeping the mental fires stoked so you don't forget about us in the new regime.

We may not be legion, but we are out there!

(y)
 
Last edited:

rhye

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Jul 27, 2016
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Yeah again any model not using medium and extra tall would get ABS by default, so the '64 ES falls into that category. Thanks!
Oh wow, I wasn't aware that the was a difference in size for rings back then. So a '64 SG has a taller bridge ring than a 335? Is this due to neck angle? Interesting
 

matkoehler

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Oh wow, I wasn't aware that the was a difference in size for rings back then. So a '64 SG has a taller bridge ring than a 335? Is this due to neck angle? Interesting
Believe it or not, at one time here were five heights used...from Extra Short, Short, Medium, Tall, Extra Tall. All had different part numbers and were molded separately (not cut down).
 

rhye

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Believe it or not, at one time here were five heights used...from Extra Short, Short, Medium, Tall, Extra Tall. All had different part numbers and were molded separately (not cut down).
Interesting!
Were the black Black Top Hat knobs and truss covers also revised as part of the True Historic plastics?
 
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